The Hidden Force of Ego: How an Unchecked Ego Damages the Lives and Careers of So Many Attorneys

Transcript

[00:00:00] This week I noticed in talking to several very successful attorneys I started to notice that there's a real pattern out there.

[00:00:08] What. Of the, kind of the way the most successful attorneys are personal characteristics that they have. And in in kind of a drive that comes from a need to satisfy their ego, that I just keep seeing over and over again. And then also with the most successful attorneys about how the even more successful than successful about how a lot of them are able to control their ego.

[00:00:31] So the Eagle is a. It's a really major topic in terms of what makes attorneys successful, but also what causes them a lot of pain in their lives and what leads them to have in many cases, very unbalanced lives. And I'm making this presentation as part of this group because  the attorneys that I work with and the attorneys that tend to follow a lot of the stuff that I write tend to be very sick.

[00:00:53]Successful and actually use the material that I provide to become successful. And if you're interested in this sort of stuff and the [00:01:00] odds are you are successful, so we're, we'll be very successful. So I wanted to go through this today with you and give you some ideas that potentially could help you.

[00:01:09] And the other thing is, I'll tell a personal story here in the beginning. But th and the reason for that is because I noticed that, most of my drive too, has come from a need to satisfy an ego. And I think a lot of the drive of most of the most successful attorneys does.

[00:01:26] And so I noticed, as I was noticing these patterns and, talking to many attorneys and and very successful ones, I noticed that I too was very much alike. And and that had something to do with that.  Between the ages of eight and 11, I personally had a lot of bad things happen and You there's certainly in the past, I'm not too bothered by them anymore, but first thing that happened actually was my parents got divorced and that's not easy.

[00:01:49] And and then I had a step sister that I was close with that was a kill while working in a fast food restaurant. And then my stepfather was at cancer and I became very sick for [00:02:00] several years. And and then that certainly caused some problems my mom and I drank and that sort of thing.

[00:02:05] And I lived in a small community and when you're young like that, you want to look. You want everything to be normal and and it's important. And I've decided to do the best I could to look as normal and to make  my family looked good.

[00:02:18] So I was, in elementary school I was, almost always the very best student in my class by far. I did a lot of energy. I put a lot of energy to sports and got very good at that a young age. Exceptionally good, where I was traveling around the state on all these special teams and stuff.

[00:02:31] And and so I made myself look very good and I based things around how my appearance looked to other people. Instead of, dealing with maybe the pain and stuff that I was feeling, I believe that I needed to challenge everything into something else. And obviously, when you're a young child and this was, decades ago, but , that stuff affects you.

[00:02:51] And the school know, knew what was happening in my home life and the problems that were going on there. And. No. So they used to try to, you get me to talk about it. They would send [00:03:00] a social worker to my art class usually when kids weren't paying attention and take me down a staircase to talk to a social worker.

[00:03:08] And I didn't happen many times. It might've helped pap on four or five times, but they would ask me how I felt and they did the right thing by that. But I certainly never said anything because I didn't want to. Make my family look bad and I certainly didn't want to be separated from my mother because I felt she needed help and my half sister and  and and I knew that if I said anything negative and it got back to my father that I could lose cut, he would lose custody and so forth.

[00:03:35] So I continued with this idea that everything was great and kept up appearances and in order to look good on the on the outside. I certainly, I didn't share what was on the outside and or on the inside and channel my energy into things like doing well in school sports.

[00:03:52] And but all the while dealing with constant problems at home, trying to, clean, clean up the house all the time. So it will look good [00:04:00] or, fixing my mom or trying to make the house look good by even doing yard work outside and stuff that I didn't have to.

[00:04:06] And. Now, because of that, I missed out on a lot of rewards that kids might normally have in their childhood and and certainly caused a lot of issues, but those are formative and they're, they're obviously positive things have happened in retrospect, but, by the time I was in seventh grade I started to all this stuff started to catch up with me because I've been holding everything in for so long and it became.

[00:04:27]Very difficult to process everything. And so I became more withdrawn and my grades started getting bad and  grew tired of trying to be the best and and ended up actually eighth grade getting kicked out of the private school for not being a good student and making some trouble.

[00:04:41] And same thing happened and ninth grade. And when you try to maintain all these appearances on the outside, while not. Taking care of yourself on the inside and being honest about how you feel and the things that are happening that has bad things happen.

[00:04:57] And and that's happened to me very [00:05:00] early and thankfully I realized a lot of that very early, but I had more problems later, but and that's something I think that a lot of attorneys do too, is they keep a lot of things on the inside and don't.  Take care of themselves.  When I was in 10th grade, I moved with my father to Thailand.

[00:05:15]And  and things actually got better. It was a matter of getting out of the environment was very helpful. And when it got out of the environment, got into a new environment around kids that were, having me know that I liked and so forth and caught better habits and was removed from the responsibilities of my mother and so forth.

[00:05:32] I changed and I suddenly were, went back to the, the person I was, and maybe in a little bit more panel sweat, And, the kids that that I left behind. They're No, I was associated with a lot of bad people and, the people you associate with and make a big difference too.

[00:05:45]And are dad from drugs and alcohol, others, who've gone to prison. At least two of them that I know of. And and none of them really turned out that well.  One of the kids I thought was going to do okay at a very wealthy father and his father bought him a liquor store to get him on track.

[00:05:59] And [00:06:00] after less than a year, that it was closed by the state. Because even knowing they selling liquor to underage kids. So the point is that it became to believe that,  when I was growing up, I could control my environment and the people around me by bending my will, meaning, whatever I wanted to do or whatever I wanted to happen.

[00:06:17]I could make things look a certain way. And when you believe you can control the world and the people around you which the most successful attorneys do can create all sorts of issues and.  One of the big lessons that you do need others to survive and you need to be vulnerable to survive.

[00:06:32]And you really can't do anything without others. Everybody needs others and and your lack of success and there, and the biggest problems you have are going to come when you don't. Rely on others. You may wonder what, what does all that have to do with your legal career?

[00:06:44] And the fact that, as I said earlier the most successful attorneys are so good and and they become successful by bending their well meaning, whatever they want, they set goals and they're very into their goals  and themselves, and almost [00:07:00] narcissistic in many cases They are very good at not being vulnerable.

[00:07:04]They don't show vulnerability to others. And and you learn early on when you're in law school. And then when you get out into legal environments that you have to be very guarded and you have to be careful about what you say, and you have to be careful about how you act. And and and a lot of that I think comes from the nature of the legal profession, because.

[00:07:24]As an attorney you're expected to support someone that could be guilty or have issues and regardless of whether or not. The person deserves that's that sort of representation you, as a respected advocate, you have to highlight all their strengths and minimize their weaknesses.

[00:07:41] And that's the same thing. That attorneys do is they have to be because that's an underlying thing in the profession. You also need to be very good at hiding your vulnerability and vulnerable attorneys do not get jobs and they're not. Viewed favorably by other attorneys. It's so funny.

[00:07:57]Because when I need, very [00:08:00] successful tomorrow when I meet very successful law firm partners very successful young attorneys, very successful, there's a, and I'm sure everybody that's listening to this has picked up on it. There's a especially when you talk to them in person, there's a certain amount of garden, they're guarded and they.

[00:08:16]They're very selective with the information they provide and they're th it's just a certain type of personality, characteristic. And, if I meet, for example, a law professor most of them don't have that. Hardly any of them do. And. A good attorney would be able to, see all that vulnerability and, different people working in different practice settings.

[00:08:34]That, that aren't necessarily in large law firms or, people that are in the government that are us attorneys and prosecutors and so forth happened, but other people in other positions don't, and it's to be very good at this, you have to be very guarded and it's something.

[00:08:49]And if you're not like that, you're going to get people to walk. People are going to walk all over you. I, when I got into legal placement I started to see how. Difficult. It was when [00:09:00] attorneys were vulnerable and I could see this, the people that weren't vulnerable and had this guardedness and so forth about how well they would do.

[00:09:08] But I started to notice that if an attorney was vulnerable in ever shared their weaknesses, that they would have an extremely difficult time getting a job, some examples, being unemployed that, that looks like a weakness. And so that's a vulnerability or. If you've lost a job because you had issues your last employer, many times turn into a board, hiring those people, or,  if you want less work, that connotes a lack of strength and, it's difficult to get positions many times, or if you've had any types of personal issues in the past, whether it's, health or substance abuse or anything you've done, or lawsuits, it can be very challenging and yeah.

[00:09:44] So you're expected really not to have, and this I'm not saying this is right, but you're not expected to have any personal issues. And you're almost expected to be like I was with the child where everything looks great, even though it's not. And if people try to talk to you about stuff you clam up.

[00:09:58] Like I did when I was a [00:10:00] child, when they're the. The school, a social worker was trying to talk to me. Those are and that's a very dangerous thing. For, from my standpoint, it really ground me hurt me up inside, hurt me inside. It's like when you keep everything in like that, and you can't tell her when you can't move vulnerable, it hurts you.

[00:10:16] And it, from my standpoint, it it made me obviously, very upset and. The thing is, being an attorney is one of the professions that is, there's more and happiness for a lot of people and it can be a very tough profession for many attorneys.

[00:10:31] And and a lot of it comes from the fact that you can't be human all the time. And and that's, and the more human you are the less desirable you are to employers, which is absolutely crazy. And the less successful it'll be. With an employer and it's just and I'm not saying any of that's, I'm just saying that's the rule. And this process I went through as a child, almost, it was a. Lesson that you know, that I'm able to provide you today because I've seen what it can do to people. And [00:11:00] I've seen what it does to attorneys that, to make all this their emphasis.

[00:11:03] And, when you, there's so many attorneys that are governed by their ego, and I'm gonna talk about them today. And and the most successful ones are, and even some of the most successful ones that aren't successful are it's this whole thing that, you can't share your feelings.

[00:11:15] You have to.  You have to present  this facade of the world and you have to keep doing it. And it's not just in the legal profession, but I believe that. Because of some of the characteristics of what's expected of lawyers as advocates for people it becomes a lot more emphasize on legal profession that might be otherwise.

[00:11:33] And law firms in particular and the best law firms want to hire people that appear strong. And the more vulnerable you look frankly, the less likely you are to get hired or advance in a law firm. You have to be, you have to look very strong. Last week. I was talking to a very talented recruiter in our company who I think it's, done very well this year.

[00:11:53]Made several large placements and lots of placements. And and she was saying something [00:12:00] to me that I thought was interesting. She was saying that. She doesn't, she gets a lot of them contacting her, but she doesn't feel safe working with very successful law firm partners.

[00:12:09]We have all these people contacting us and there that want to work with us. And a lot of times are, major, people that, are very successful. And but the problem with them is in most cases they don't really want help. They. They get involved and then they try, with us and then they try to control.

[00:12:28] The situation and they won't take advice and let us be, the equivalent of their lawyers, finding them a job. They want to be in complete control and they they're difficult to advise a lot of times they don't take feedback. They don't want feedback. And because of that because of this need to control everything which is an eco type thing they don't get the results that they otherwise would get.

[00:12:51]In terms of getting the best results and it's really honestly, it's the most successful law firm partners to try to control everything. The ones that have arisen. [00:13:00] The highest. Now the highest of the highest, I typically don't do this, but the ones that have arisen the highest not legal profession typically they want to do that.

[00:13:07] And they believe that they know everything our most everything and take off and take complete control over the situation. And don't take advice. And the reason is because they're used to being empowered and dictating the terms and they people, when you're the boss, they're.

[00:13:24]There used to be in this artist person in the room, at least with, people that are doing work for them. And and they typically aren't the best to take in advice. And I'm not saying there's anything wrong with that. That's, if I was going to an attorney for help I would certainly be.

[00:13:38] You're very stuff, a large company, how is a large company? I wouldn't be very reassured if my attorney was on top of everything and,  in control of the situation. So that's a good characteristic, but it's an ego type thing. And when I first started recruiting I started working with a lot of partners and.

[00:13:55]I knew. I noticed that most of the time they weren't willing to listen to my suggestions. They [00:14:00] didn't want feedback. They would do a lot of the work on their own. A lot of times, most of the time, they didn't even want help negotiating salary. They would do that all on their own and they would really just take control of the entire situation.

[00:14:11] And that type of characteristic is what people that go to the top of the legal profession have and what they do. And it's just something to be aware of. People that are doing that are really among, that's a characteristic is controlling everything, not You're getting a lot of feedback, being very circumspect with information, not sharing information, like they wouldn't even share information with me because I wanted to be secretive about it.

[00:14:35]And the attorneys were often vague about the reasons for moving and. So it was always difficult and and they often were very prejudicial against listening to suggestions about different firms and I, wouldn't only, consider things that they knew about and so forth and there's nothing wrong with any of that.

[00:14:53] And that's a. It's a characteristic and it's nothing that's going to change ever. But the problem with [00:15:00] that is, when you try to control everything around you and force your will on situations you're going to miss out on opportunities. You're not going to receive feedback and you're likely to repeat negative situations in your career.

[00:15:16] Meaning whatever reason they were moving. The first time they're likely to move again. And and they're not going to get feedback and they're never going to improve where they are and whatever's making them unhappy. It's going to continue to do the same thing. And this is the whole idea of control.

[00:15:31] Like I tried to control my environment. Think about museum, child, doing all the yard work running to the, eight or nine years old to the. The, the local nursery to plant flowers in front of, it just, it's just insanity and trying to control everything and you can't control everything.

[00:15:47] And that's one of the biggest lessons, when you start learning to, get rid of your ego, is that you're going to be much happier when you're not trying to control it with him because he attorney who's trying to control everything by the way. Is constantly and think about yourself, [00:16:00] constantly worrying about all these little things that could go wrong and it's exhausting.

[00:16:04] And you can't control the world. The world's going to go on without you. And and you're going to be it doesn't matter. You can control certain things, but this whole sense of control. Keeping things in and so forth. It's a big part of the legal profession. A big part of the most successful attorneys is going to do profound damage to your psyche and so forth if you keep it and and you need to understand that sort of thinking, but it's not I'm going to hurt you.

[00:16:30]It's going to hurt you. When people do job searches with me people get incredible results.  If they work with me and they do the things that I say, and but the most successful people listen, they including,  very successful partners they do their job searches.

[00:16:44] They tend to want a lot of feedback. They tend to look at. Lots of different things. They're open to learning. They want information. They ask questions are very good listeners. They're willing to talk about the things that bothered them and be vulnerable because,  you're a vulnerable, if they're [00:17:00] vulnerable with me, who's their advisor.

[00:17:01] That's no different than. Going to anybody that would advise you about something they give me information that can help me also make them more attractive to employers and you are more attractive to illegal employer for vulnerable and it right away. Or if you let someone else make you a little bit vulnerable, but you're not going to be vulnerable.

[00:17:18]If you approach things the wrong way from a sense of weakness.  Was recently working with a very successful. From partners, it was looking for a position and he had was it one of the top 10 largest firms in the country and had a book of business and you could have worked at a variety of firms.

[00:17:34]He had a decent book of business.  You had best schools and everything was very attractive to law firms. And but his whole thing was you need to control the situation. He was very discriminated and he only was willing to look at a few firms and. Wasn't willing to listen to advice about,  places he should talk to and so forth.

[00:17:55] And it was very circumspect with information. Never wanted to talk on the [00:18:00] phone very long when I started asking you personal questions about different things, not too personal, but personal to him  he would get very uncomfortable and wouldn't answer them. And. And he'd also lost his job.

[00:18:11] We had a limited amount of time to find a new one, which I learned later from him. And wouldn't share his compensation firms had applied to or anything. And. When I did send him out an interview, she wasn't interested in getting any advice. He just basically regarding the interviews and not even let me know how it went.

[00:18:29]The thing that happened is he ended up taking a position with a firm that primarily does insurance, and he's not an insurance liar. He's a corporate attorney from a 1000 plus person law firm. And.  The law firm insurance firm, he took a job with didn't even have a corporate practice.

[00:18:46] So he was going to be the only corporate attorney in their office and the office city he's in, and he's not in their main office. And and he refused to allow anybody to help him with the situation he wouldn't give up control. And that [00:19:00] idea of not giving up control is something that I'm sure it's going to cost him.

[00:19:04]Millions of dollars over his legal career the rest of his legal career. If he stays at that firm like that and and all sorts of problems and because he got the job and through not through me, but he would have been much more successful. Had he been willing to give up some control?

[00:19:19]So that's a problem and, if you try to bend your will and keep just decided that he didn't his kind of his idea was he was only applying to places where he wouldn't get rejected, so he could maintain this kind of thought about himself and so forth.

[00:19:32] And and it just wasn't good. And the thing is a lot of what I talk about and, and if you read articles on my blog Harrison Barnes, and you study things that I've written and thought about. And I talk about a lot of what I talk about is, using various thinking tools and, and things to really  to improve your life and to get.

[00:19:56] Where you want. And the fact is, within reason, I mean [00:20:00] anybody that want something, whatever it is. If, if it's financial or, it's social power or politics or whatever. If you really put your mind to something you can get it.

[00:20:12]Or you can get very close to it. It's not.  It's not that hard. There's all sorts of,  books and things you can read that will tell you about it, but or my log, but if you really want to be a partner in a major law firm, you can do it or you really want to be Okay.

[00:20:26]A successful in-house attorney in general counsel of one of the top companies in the country, you can do it. It doesn't matter who you are, you there's certain thinking tools and so forth. And a lot of it comes from bending your will. It's it's just making that your goal and exactly what you want to do.

[00:20:41] And for me this type of thinking process, It's certainly gotten a lot of things for me. But it's also caused me a lot of problems,  about over 15 years ago, I was driving through Malibu one day and I saw an open house. And this is just a crazy story. I had another house mound with the time and also had a house in Pasadena.

[00:20:58] That was very nice. It was [00:21:00] a compound. And I liked the house and my wife at the time said it was her dream house. And. But I still, I decided, you know what, I'm gonna buy this house. And and, I decided I'd have this house. And and I, I thought to myself, if I want it, I can have it.

[00:21:14] It doesn't matter. And I've done this with, I had done this until that point with a lot of things in my vicinity there was a building once across the street from Other building that I owned and was working in that I had more space than I needed. And I decided that I'd want it own it, put my name on it and made it happen which was crazy.

[00:21:32]I didn't get any appraisals or anything. I just decided I would have it. And I paid what it was worth. And I figured out. How to get a bank, give me the financing. And I got, and and when I purchased the building that I was working in at the time I paid the builder exactly what he asked for it and and ended up making mistakes, but I decided I wanted it.

[00:21:52] And I had, and this idea of deciding you want something and habit is the idea of it's a very kind of.  [00:22:00] Ego centered personal development type thing where you just say, I'm going to make this happen. I'm going to focus on it and it will happen. And things like that do happen.

[00:22:08] But anyway, this house that was just crazy to buy was not a good thing. And I'll S I've gone with the legal profession, have the same idea and decided I would be an attorney. And and I focused on it and I decided where I go to law school and then the kind of work I would do and and put all my will into it and succeeded doing it.

[00:22:28] And I bought cars that I wanted when I worked at this, ridiculously expensive house, I was driving like a rolls Royce Phantom, which is just ridiculous.  And it's just stupid. Ridiculous is what I mean. No one needs that kind of car. You don't, there's no need for anything close to that, but I did those things and and so the idea is, you can force your will.

[00:22:47]And you can really achieve anything. In terms of getting jobs, in terms of advancing in terms of making money, in terms of building companies, in terms of finding your soulmate anything you want you can [00:23:00] get if you force your will onto it. And up until that point, I had really been able to force my  and get whatever I wanted out of life, really by.

[00:23:08]Using a lot of these self-improvement techniques which, which essentially are and I can talk about them later on, not today, but are about creating goals. Making sure you reinforce those goals over and over again, your self-consciousness a conch conscious, mind and then pushing forward and after remind yourself about them constantly, and to achieve those things and you can get whatever you want.

[00:23:30] If you understand those techniques and the most successful people out there, are able to work themselves up and do a frenzy  and get the things they want. So if you really want to be have a $20 million book of business inside of a law firm, you can do it.

[00:23:44]You'd just have to make that your focus, or if you really want to buy a super expensive house, you can do it. You can do all these things. You just and and I can certainly show you how to do it, but it's just, it's not. It's about just ignoring everything else and having those goals.

[00:24:00] [00:23:59] So from my standpoint, this house was completely financially irresponsible. Not only did it have all this other real estate that was a waste of money and it was sucking up money, but it was, I had no idea that a recession was coming. And and there's a huge recession in 2008 and that's made supporting everything very difficult.

[00:24:17] And I wasn't thinking things through, I was bending my will and desires to, what I wanted and I was doing things that really weren't feasible and didn't make much sense.  At the same time In order to make this happen. I had a a bookkeeper and Pasadena, that would pretty much do whatever I wanted.

[00:24:35] I had a hands-off accountant and and and th they knew that I would get whatever I wanted to fight built my will. There's a. There was a story that I heard. It was interesting and I'm bringing it up because it's just ridiculous and but there's a very famous person in the self-improvement industry.

[00:24:52] And one day when he was starting out, he went to his and he wasn't starting on me. He'd been at of maybe [00:25:00] 10 years, he went to his. Bookkeeper and you said, I need $250,000 to do something. And and she said if we do that, we won't have payroll. And he said, I don't care. Figure out how to get it done.

[00:25:08] And, which is just completely self-centered. And and then you can see it's all about him, but it's also about this whole will. Things will happen and so forth. So anyway, so that the house was a very  irresponsible. And I also, at the time my wife said something that said, if you can pull it off would be an amazing to superstar and, and so I decided that was going to control how I, what I thought I wanted to look like a superstar purchased a home.

[00:25:33] It was too far from where I lived and, just as time went by was a horrible decision. And and the cost me a lot of money. It costs me a lot of worry for several years because there was no financing available and introduced me to people that weren't very good. Whereas I was trying to get finance to create his training, my marriage, and and I was trying to do more than I could, and I was trying to bend my will to prove something to myself and the world.

[00:25:56] And I guess my wife at the time and. And my ego control what I [00:26:00] was doing and I avoided people like very good accountants and so forth that would have helped me question my decisions because it would have, they would have been, an interfere with my ego and these were selfish and not smart decisions.

[00:26:14] And as time had gone by I've realized that I also became. The way I am in many cases because of lessons and so forth that I have learned along the way. And I'm going to talk to you a little bit more about the dangers of isolating yourself and getting advice from others.

[00:26:30] But I think this is an interesting story. One day when I was walking to work years before this house, I was walking into a parking garage and there was a man in a turbine. And he came up to me and said that I had good luck or something. And he had a message from God, for me, or it's ridiculous.

[00:26:46] And at the time I was working these really long hours it was a weird time. I think it was around. September 11th or something. And and he came up to me and told me to guess a number from one and one to 10, the name of a flower. And then he turned around and wrote something on a [00:27:00] piece of paper, folded up and put it into my hand.

[00:27:02] And. And sure enough I guess the number six and I chose a violin for the flour. And then when I opened up the piece of paper, it's a violin number, sit with sex and I was in shock and I thought this guy really must be sent from somewhere. This is amazing. I've never seen anything like this.

[00:27:18] And then he started to tell me a bunch of personal stuff that seemed, incredibly on point. So this is you're comfortable, being willingly one woman at a time, which actually most people are your parents were divorced. And you're trying to do grew up trying to do everything on your own.

[00:27:31] And most people more than 50% of people I think are from divorced families, so he. The things that he said, actually, we're not I'll tell you in a minute, but something, he said the most that he said, never get any partners. If you get any partners lined up on the street.

[00:27:44] And that really scared me. I was like, where did that come from? Cause he said all these things that were true and and I never really understood there. So no. Then he asked me for some money and I think I gave him all the money pocket. I was literally slapshot and I was astonished and they'd come up [00:28:00] about $60.

[00:28:01]And then he's told me that God had sent him and all this stuff, and then he walked away and I was really amazed. I'd been conned of course, but th the idea of his trick is, most people pick, the number six, because you don't want to pick a five because it's too obvious you don't pick Rose because it's too obvious.

[00:28:17] And so people's minds automatically go to the number six. And automatically go to the nut, to the violence. So most of the time it's statistically people get that right. And this is a con it's not a con it's like a mind game that people play, but, and he's vague insights into my life and character left me believing.

[00:28:35]That there must have been something special to all this knowledge and that I, really needed to be careful with getting partners and and really look into that. And at the time there were people trying to be my partners. I had a man that had a once owned the largest recruiting firm in Cal legal recruiting firm in California, desperately wanted to be my partner at the time and was, coming downtown, taking me out to lunch at least probably once a week.

[00:28:58]I, I felt, I'm decided that once I [00:29:00] heard this guy that I wasn't gonna be involved with him. And then other people that want him to be my partner and so in some respects, this guy's advice, actually, it was very helpful to have the people that wanted to be my partners turned out to have just horrible characters and, getting got involved in a lengthy, public drawn out lawsuits with partners that they found later that.

[00:29:20] You know that that I reject and after I rejected them and actually had multiple lawsuits and just bad partnership agreements and, disputes and I wouldn't have been hurt by this and I actually might've had my business destroy it if that happens. So it was probably smart to listen to it.

[00:29:36]But then what wasn't smart is years later after. Right after moving into this house, a private equity company came to me and wanted to give me I don't know a lot of money, like $10 million and half of a business. They bought that and you would have heard of for $65 million in exchange for a couple of companies that I own, which wasn't BCG or anything like that.

[00:29:59] And so I [00:30:00] told you the idea for a while, but turned it down because I was afraid. Of getting partners and this was a mistake and it was a mistake because,  first of all, the business that they had that they bought for $65 million has grown dramatically. Since that they would have would their professional advisors and teams to taught me to do business.

[00:30:18] It's a different level. In terms of this particular niche they were in. And and then at the same time they would have pushed me and helped me and evaluated me. It's given me more direction and oversight which would have been good. So my need to control the situation, which I had as a child and,  and going through, and they have said the attorney and.

[00:30:37] All of these different sorts of things actually harm me. So it hurt me in this advice from the S guy on the street, hurt me in one respect that actually helped me in others. But ultimately when you look at the most successful business most of them are, there are.

[00:30:52]Private equity and other types of it advisors involved. And that actually helps people quite a bit and credit taught me. So [00:31:00] the idea is, when you become a very successful attorney  you have the ability and you should to bend your desires into whatever you want to do. People didn't become partners and major law firms don't do it. It doesn't just happen to them. They have to really focus on it and want it if you want to go in house, most people that really want to go in house, stand up, able to do that and figure out how to do that.

[00:31:22]If they whatever you want in the legal profession, if you want to work in a better law firm or you want to go to work as a. As a prosecutor, almost everyone I know that has set a goal and stuck to it and been very serious about it has actually achieved those goals. And. You can achieve whatever you want.

[00:31:39]If you are able to bend your will and become very successful in terms of your motivation. But the problem is when you do all these things and you don't take, your ego controls, everything.

[00:31:50] It can actually hurt you quite a bit and it can harm you and,  and I'm going to tell you about that. In a moment. Okay. So I was recently, it was funny. I was fired [00:32:00] by an attorney and I've been in this like stupid lawsuit about nothing for years. And and and the attorney literally has been billing me tens of thousands of dollars a month.

[00:32:11] I'm just continuing to when both sides really want settle this thing, and there's not a ton of money involved and not getting any results. And he's just creating more animosity in both sides and trying to keep both sides apart. And I saw what he was doing and and because I used to be a litigator and the more I looked at it, the more I understood it.

[00:32:30] And one thing he did is like the other side, wanted to reach down and said, sit down for settlement discussion. He didn't tell me about it. Discuss it with me. And I only learned about it later. And then the other side actually served discovery way past the discovery deadline. And and instead of telling them no discovery deadlines passed, he didn't object.

[00:32:49] And. And then wanting to respond to all the discovery so as I saw all these things happening and learn what was going on, I decided that, this was saying it wasn't being serviced by my attorney. And [00:33:00] it's been manipulated. So I brought up everything that I'd seen in terms of how this attorney was extended litigation.

[00:33:06] And I sent copies to my attorney the associates working on the case as well. And then. The partner and the associate working on the other side and the attorney farming and and the idea was, is the attorney had a huge ego and was pushing his will on me and doing things to make money, but also to,  monitor to be in control.

[00:33:27] And I was also doing the same thing that, partners have done with me when I'm trying to advise them on their job searches. And I was trying to bend my will to get what I wanted from them as well. And this just created negative results and. And on both sides and I found someone willing to listen to me so I surrounded myself.

[00:33:45] I found a new attorney that was willing to listen and you need to understand the power of your ego and your, how you want to see yourself and how. What's going on in your  your environment and your career. Cause a lot of times [00:34:00] people will, use their ego to build themselves up and power through life trying to reach something ego.

[00:34:06] Is something that makes you buy houses, you can't afford it makes you take jobs. You think you should have, but make you unhappy and makes you want to look like a certain type of person. It makes you want to sometimes do things to the detriment of your clients, so you make more money and can look a certain way.

[00:34:25]It wants. To show the world, cause you want to show the world that you mash them, its rules and all these things cause so many problems. They're just, they're bad. And one of the stupidest things I ever did when I realized, I'm thinking about it in the past where the things that I've done with my ego is.

[00:34:41] I received an email. I think, when I was, I don't know, maybe seven or eight years out of college, maybe not even that maybe four years, I don't know. But and this from a class secretary, just asking me what I was doing and it was probably a form email that just went out to everyone. And, I get those things these days and I don't really feel a [00:35:00] real need to tell people anything that I'm doing.

[00:35:02] And I haven't since that this particular email, but I decided to respond to it. And and I responded about, what I had done in law school firms I've worked with all these different things that I've done growing this company and and I was very proud of what I've written and sent it off to this class secretary and which, who takes the time to do something like that.

[00:35:23]It's just insane. And about a month or so later when these class notes came out for the university of Chicago magazine, it was just, there was this whole a long thing about that I'd written this email had been basically cut and paste and I couldn't believe that they published it.

[00:35:39] It's actually pretty funny that they and I was very proud of it at first, but there were typos in it. And and then I realized later on that there was really something wrong with that. First of all, most people at college don't even know who you are.

[00:35:52]But at the same time, I was allowing I was trying to puff myself up in front of other people and say how great it was and who cares. It's [00:36:00] just, it's ridiculous. And and a lot of times when people are young they think all those kinds of stuff's important and they're trying to aspire to something and show people how great they are, but it doesn't really lead anywhere important.

[00:36:12] And.  I had an experience not too long ago and a very successful attorney asked me if any law firms attorneys that I work with that are incredibly successful are happy and have real rounded lives. And and the most successful attorneys by the way, tend to have books of business that are.

[00:36:30]At least $5 million annually.  That's to become very successful, like a major us law firm. That's the, what the level is, and it may sound impossible to you now, but if you're listening to this and you listen to the stuff I'm teaching, it's not going to be anywhere.

[00:36:45] Don't think it's impossible for almost anyone, the very few attorneys in this category felt that I. Ever met or worked with who were happy at work then also at home in another areas of their lives. They may do well at work, but [00:37:00] they have bad, series of all sorts of romantic relationships, or they have relationships with their children that are bad or they may have horrible health problems or substance abuse problems and things while they're doing well professionally.

[00:37:12]They may be motivated, but their motivation is all focused on work. And how they look to their peers and other people. And that ends up ultimately causing them a lot of trouble. So when I said this to this attorney, he was shocked and he seemed taken back because he realized that,  all the stuff that he was doing and all this ambition wasn't really going to get him where he wanted to be.

[00:37:35] Even though he was, his whole focus had been on his career and his life, he realized that if he was going to be happy and successful, Maybe the way he was pushing himself, wasn't the way to get there. I have a neighbor that's actually interesting. He he's no longer my neighbor cause he died.

[00:37:51]But he was on vacation in The Bahamas or maybe it was Bermuda and And one morning his wife found him and he was wearing a seat back mask and [00:38:00] it was clogged with and Ceefax, but you were, I guess when you snore at night and he had some weight problems and so he had problems breathing and when he slapped him.

[00:38:08] You wear this mask at night.  She found him in the morning with this mask still on, but there was cocaine all around the edges on the mask. And the man was literally only 55 years old and he was. Very young and But he was had a very successful business is finance business.

[00:38:24] And and when he was younger, he sold a predecessor to his existing business for $120 million. And and then he'd also been when he was younger, a cocaine addict and and then he quit cocaine and then became sober. And then he wasn't sober again. And. And then divorced his first wife when he was mixed.

[00:38:42] I really, for news, I believe in the married a personal trainer that you'd hired to get, help him get in shape. And I guess she, unfortunately never did, but she did become his wife.  Anyway, so I, would meet this guy and he talked about, all the money he made and his private jet and he'd gamble millions of dollars in Las Vegas on the [00:39:00] weekends.

[00:39:00] And I went there with him a few times and I watched him, he would literally bet Quarter million dollars per hand for hours at a time, he would just, have these $50,000 chips and put five of them down. And it was literally hard to believe. The I mean that someone could bet this much money and, I stayed with him at the Bellagio one time and I stood at different places.

[00:39:20] And he was in a suite. It must've been at least 7,000 square feet. It had its own pool overlooking the pool of the Bellagio a private gym theater. A full kitchen. We would go out to clubs they'd give us these, $5,000 bottles of champagne. They didn't, he, everything was calm for him.

[00:39:39]And even when my wife and I were with him, the hotel would give us like these just giant sweets. That were, the size of the house. And just cause we're with him. And, every 4th of July had a massive party. At his house in Malibu and sit on the beach and you'd have a DJ up on the roof with speakers, blaring things, and very expensive caters and [00:40:00] famous rap stars and basketball stars would stop by and it was funny cause a lot of them would drive around and like Lamborghinis and stuff.

[00:40:07] And then I remember, and then they'd parked their Lamborghini's and then they'd have a security detail behind them that would. Guard their Lamborghinis and make sure that no one messed with them and it was just flying. And then at night a giant barge would be pulled out in front of his house and towed from somewhere and then do this huge firework show for all of Malibu actually.

[00:40:26]Which was really nice. But a few years before he died  I was in I heard he was in New York and he was talking to a private equity firm and. About getting an investment into his company. And when he was there, I guess he had some sort of panic attack. He fell and ended up in the hospital for a few days.

[00:40:42] And at the time I, it just occurred to me like, that this is just something seems wrong. It's just, I don't know. I just felt like, if you're talking to these finance people, you, why would you be talking to them if you're doing so well financially? And. And and I just something seemed wrong and he bragged to me when he came back, but how [00:41:00] he'd raised all this money and and seemed to think all that was important.

[00:41:03] And so when he died there was literally according to his wife, he had no money. The casinos had liens all of his bank accounts because he had a line of credit with them and. Hadn't paid it. And so there all the money that was in his accounts, he no one could touch this particular guy is an example of someone,  that is always seeking.

[00:41:26]Some sort of w was seeking some sort of validation and,  when he was in Las Vegas, it was pretty funny. We all went in there and, he would sometimes take his plane and then other times like the casinos would pick them up or driving back and forth and their planes.

[00:41:41] And, so one time we were with is with him, his wife, his child, and my kids and my wife. And and we all went back to the the. The private jet hangar, like in a little bus, but  he took a, a rolls Royce limousine, the, it should be like, so they would, they provided that and that service, so he could ride in the limousine, which is [00:42:00] funny.

[00:42:00] So we would all get in, instead of riding with us, he'd ride in this limousine and feel important. But the idea was is, they in Las Vegas, I guess they made him feel successful in light and And I believe that, his need to satisfy this ego in this kind of addictive behavior with drugs and so forth.

[00:42:17] And the drive ultimately you killed him. And I think that same sort of drive is there with a lot of attorneys. His marriage certainly wasn't that happy. There was a series of affairs and other things and and I don't think he was that happy. I think that, everything. Was based on how he was seen.

[00:42:33] And it was very important to him and, I see this, with attorneys all the time, and this is one reason that, you know, if you understand what I'm talking about today and I'm trying to. We have a lot of personal stories in here to make it as interesting as possible, but this is really my experience I've been having advise attorneys for decades and watch what people have done and watch what's happened to me.

[00:42:55] And just in seeing what's happened to other people, I know that this need to, [00:43:00] be something or be seen or get approval or satisfy your ego can just really hurt you. And your ego is something that can certainly. Drive you forward and make you do well. But at the same time, when you have this need for approval and so forth, it can eat you up inside and make you very unhappy.

[00:43:18] There's also something else that happens. You need w when you're eat, when you're, when your ego is weak like that, it's all this reassurance. You're. You have to gamble or you have to you have to get new achievements and you have to, look better than other people, or you have to build more hours.

[00:43:34] You have to be at a better firm and you have to, talk about where you went to school or you have to, make more money or you have to get a bigger bonus. You have to do all these things and and what are you proving? What, where is that coming from? It's You don't.

[00:43:47]That sort of psychology of constantly comparing yourself to others is like a drug. And and it is a drug. I was talking to someone yesterday and. He was saying that, is this, [00:44:00] got, very serious sex addiction and th that person's getting help for.

[00:44:04] And I was like, what is, what a sex addiction? I literally, I had some ideas, but, and I didn't know what it was. And I guess it's there's people that like, just like people search out gambling or they search, they. They need a fix.

[00:44:16] So they search out, they need a drugs. There's people like that. Have to go out and find people to, look up with, but it's almost like a drive, but it could be three times a day or, five, there, and you just, and it will put them in dangerous situations, and I don't know. Who knows, but and but people also do that, with achievement and where their ego and where their, how they're being seen by others and this need for. Reassurance and, and to feel good and to feel loved. And that's just not a a positive thing that other time it can be very dangerous to you and it can be very hurtful and harm your career because you're constantly needing to achieve more and more.

[00:44:55] And and, wanting to achieve things as good, but it can also have [00:45:00] devastating impact on your life.  So not other day not the other day, but it was anyway, but that was a couple of weeks ago. I called one of my early mentors. And he'd been a very. Well-known successful attorney years ago.

[00:45:15] And and and so he left a very good law firm and went to smaller law firm, which I wasn't sure why. But  he I'm assuming that from what I understood that he felt like he was losing a lot of his power at the firm he was at and the respect.

[00:45:30]And getting constant reassurances of, how good he was and and certainly they felt undermined. And that's actually an interesting thing.  Like I started out at this kind of, from that was, became this huge firm of a thousand people. But, when I started there, it was like,  smaller and when it was and when it got bigger more and more competitive people started coming in and more and more  got more competitive.

[00:45:52] The culture changed and and people it, it became more of this guarded kind of center type thing. And so people that had been there [00:46:00] when it was smaller, suddenly felt  don't know if undermined is the right word, but not recognized, not important like they're weren't being didn't get the reassurance and for their egos and so forth and actually got pushed down and so forth.

[00:46:13]Whereas before they felt built up and that's a problem. That's something that when you need that, It can be a problem. And so all these people were leaving for that reason because their ego wasn't getting the same sort of reassurance that it had gotten before. So he left his, this firm and went to a smaller firm.

[00:46:31] And shortly thereafter, his marriage for some reason collapsed his wife came after him. And then he decided at some point  shortly thereafter, a year or two later to go in house, And when he got him home he was against going in house by the way is one thing I'm going to talk about next week.

[00:46:47] Cause that's, it can be a good thing, but it can also be a very harmful thing to many people, but  he got in house and he was up against a very powerful management team run by professional managers. And [00:47:00] just like he wasn't getting his ego fed in the F the small firm, he went to actually, he did go to a small firm and then he moved from anyway.

[00:47:07] It doesn't matter, but just like he wasn't getting his ego fed in the next firm. He went to he went to a new firm and went in house and and these managers weren't feeding as you go. And in fact they, when you're in house, a lot of times when there's managers, they want you to give them.

[00:47:23]Tell them what they want to hear. They don't necessarily always want you to give them advice, but he would, was trying to tell them what they should do and what they were doing was wrong. And. And this upset them. And eventually they fired him from his high-profile general counsel job.

[00:47:37] And he and he had antagonized them wrote them just told them they were wrong and so forth. And and then they found some things that he, they thought he had done wrong and they sued him publicly and some sort of nuisance, Sue for malpractice. Yeah.

[00:47:51]It's a question again of two egos coming up against each other. And he was doing the same thing. I was dealing with my attorney with these people. It's about this ego kind of fight and it's just, it's [00:48:00] almost never ending. So I called him at three in the afternoon to check in with him.

[00:48:03] This was a person that, is, Nationally recognized. Very, smart person and to, to check in with him and after ministry on the phone, I could tell he was drunk as he was slurring his words and laughing inappropriately. And it was funny actually, I was smiling and I wasn't sad by it, at the same time I didn't expect him to be drunk during the Workday.

[00:48:22] And and the thing was that was actually sad. And that I realized when I was talking to him.  And this is the sad part, and this is something that happens to a lot of people.  And something you need to look out for is that he actually had lost his ego. He'd given up, he was at a firm that he didn't need to be at.

[00:48:43]I, and I wasn't calling him to recruit him. I was just calling to check on him, but he was in a state of defeat and. And because of his age, I don't, I doubt he'll ever recover. He, his ego finally after all these things that had happened to him was crushed. And so you have two [00:49:00] competing things here.

[00:49:00] You have. The idea that maybe his ego is something, he would always this kind of guy that would always tell you about how these things you've done. All his success, successes, all his, and and build himself up. And that's really something that very successful attorneys do, but it can also get out of control.

[00:49:16] But this particular guy whose ego was, had been finally crushed, I think. And the ego is your is your greatest strength, but it's also your greatest weakness. And.  And think about all the people that you know, that. After all sorts of rejection, their ego is crushed and then they S they stop trying, or, they in, in recessions, for example, the market, they may not be very good.

[00:49:39] And so there's a lot of rejection because the firms simply don't have the opportunity. And so people's egos are crossed or. Layoffs and things, it's just, or, you have a bad experience where you're your fire and your is crushed. And so a lot of people, what happens is they give up and they give up and they think my place is something else, or it's doing this or it's doing [00:50:00] this.

[00:50:00] And they give up, I talked to A woman a couple of days ago. And and she doesn't really do anything now, but she when she was younger, she was a real estate agent. And and one of her first clients that she brought in was Brad Pitt and Angelina Jolie. I don't know how she met them, but they were looking for to buy some property or to sell some profit or something.

[00:50:21] And and. And she was in her early twenties when she brought them in and and her broker. Your real estate agent and then the brokers above you, her broker came swooped in and took the client away from her and just, it just crushed her. And. And she ended up leaving the business and, so a lot of times people's egos get crushed.

[00:50:40]Think about all the people around you that have given up,  because something became too difficult. Think about yourself. Have you thought about giving up, think about, why you're thinking about giving up  and how, your ego and the thing is the ego Is  very important it's something that  you need, but you can't let control you.

[00:50:59] So there's it's [00:51:00] one of the most important things for success for attorneys and for other people in the world is making sure. You know that your ego is properly managed and most people don't successfully do it. And most people give up and the ones that don't that keep their egos going like that, and, making mistakes for their ego or their ego hurts them or kills them.

[00:51:20] So it's this thing that controls a lot of times what happens in your life. So this particular guy Probably never will recover. When I tried to help him I don't know.  This ego force was, he was keeping everything inside and probably  and then leading him to drink.

[00:51:37] And I don't know it's too bad, but the, and then not a set of sites high anymore in terms of what he could accomplish this whole force. Your ego is just, it's fascinating about how important it is, the legal profession. And then at the same time, the most successful attorneys that.

[00:51:53] That they are able to build themselves up and to