How Can You Avoid Drama and Find Happiness as an Attorney?

Transcript

[00:00:00] I'm going to talk today about the best way to avoid drama and find happiness as an attorney. And one of the reasons is that I thought that this was important and that very important career thing to, to cover is because a lot of attorneys end up really

[00:00:20] drama. They do it in their work lives and their personal lives. And that's something that I noticed keeps a lot of people, very SAS, and what ends up ultimately happening with our careers and lives. So I'm going to talk a lot about this today and  it's going to be a fairly in depth presentation, but if you understand a message here, it's something that I think can really help you.

[00:00:49] And we'll help you have a very good career in life as an attorney in whatever you do. So one of the smartest people that I know and I grew up [00:01:00] in terms of his IQ  he certainly,  he would, if you tried to, engage in complex arguments with him, it would be difficult for him to argue back.

[00:01:10]He was never that interested in I would say competitive socially, Wising or and that sort of thing. And and really is a general rule. You have someone that kind of came across as not that intelligent or sophisticated, but despite that fact, I believe that this particular person and other people like him, that I met he's one of the smartest people I've ever known.

[00:01:31]When I first met him, I was very surprised because when I was younger and I was tended to be negative and I would point out things that were wrong  and things that were wrong with people and situations and so forth. And his reaction was always just not really to pay attention to it.

[00:01:49] And, and almost as if he was bored, he would get off the phone or he would walk away. And and he just wasn't critical. He wasn't really critical of anybody. He wasn't critical of other students in the school, his teachers. [00:02:00] Or his parents and so forth and and certainly had reasons to be because he wasn't the greatest student and he had other issues, but kids, I knew at the time were coping with stress by, smoking, drinking smoking pot and using some, even using harder drugs.

[00:02:18] Come in. I remember there was some girl, they used to go smoke, crack cocaine in high school, and it was a boarding school, a very competitive one.  But he, this particular person never drank, never smoked never used drugs and never really had any interest in any way. Just try with just very average grades.

[00:02:37] And he wasn't from a wealthy family and he was happy not having a nice car or clothes and just being very average. And what I always liked about him was that and I ended up. Fascinating. It was just so refreshing to be around someone that just didn't have a negative take on anything.

[00:02:56] He was just very straightforward and I really liked [00:03:00] that. And I, and that was just such a rare characteristic to find someone that wasn't interested in drama or other things. And do you know Andy, when everyone around him most students and even teachers and everybody, we're always finding reasons to be upset.

[00:03:16] And Case, I knew a kid in my school that had gotten a 1518, his SATs, which at the time was almost a perfect score. Maybe he missed a couple of questions and that he'd missed something. And the, in the vocabulary section when he'd gotten this 1580, so he had a dictionary and in the bathroom and ended up cheating during the task in order to get a perfect score.

[00:03:37] And he did get a perfect score, but he told the wrong people and yeah. And then he ended up only getting into. When could college and cause he teachers found out and made sure that he didn't get anywhere. But the point is, people were worried about very inconsequential things and really getting themselves into a, a hissy about that.

[00:03:56] And my friend had all these problems. I mean his life [00:04:00] someone had both of his parents died from smoking. One of them when he was in high school and then another one later and one of his siblings titled. The drug overhaul hosts and just all around him were all these people that were having all these problems.

[00:04:14] And a lot of the problems I think, were due to their perception, when you put people in in a competitive environment and they're surrounded by competitive people, if they don't measure up, they feel very bad about themselves. And they take refuge and alcohol or drugs, or other self-destructive behavior.

[00:04:33] And this particular guy I always noticed just never cared. He never had any of that drama and stuff. Never bothered him, never. It's just something that wasn't an issue for him and which I found interesting. And and I would say that, as a someone that was watching him I would be the first to admit that, he, because he wasn't.

[00:04:55] So competitive because he wasn't worried about what other people were doing and really [00:05:00] trying to get ahead. I figured not much whatever happened to him. I figured, that this particular way of approaching the world would be something that would lead to a life of just being very average and not much happening to him, but I was absolutely wrong.

[00:05:14]By the time he was in his thirties he had a very successful business. He was known nationally in this business. And I stole leader in his profession he does extremely well financially. He's pretty, well-known nationally and he's happily married and doing well and year after year he's successful and he keeps being successful and doing well, and he's happy and he doesn't have issues with substances or depression, or, or any of that.

[00:05:41] And he's just very happy and doing well. Yeah. And all without this drama and, so to me his ability to not this drama, I believe has made him a very successful and happy person. And in, based on the kind of people that, I've certainly [00:06:00] watched him been around and their competitiveness and so forth and comparing themselves to others and so forth.

[00:06:05]This particular guys who ability to not drama around him has made him. Very happy and successful. And and I always,  noticed that he was so unusual when I was in high school and I noticed that even today and and I believe that, people that can do that and turn that out.

[00:06:24]That's a real strength and it's something that very few people can do because most people are comparing themselves to others. They're feeling bad about their situation. They're feeling like they need to get ahead. Like they need to prove. And this guy just keeps coasting and is happy.

[00:06:37] It's just the most amazing thing.  This summer in my  office here and Malibu, I hired a first year law student. And and to my astonishment this person ended up being a better attorney than many attorneys that I've worked with in my career. Both in terms of in major law firms and [00:07:00] then people that I've hired she did this without taking the bar exam without having studied more than two semesters in law school.

[00:07:08] And I was amazed by this and I hired this person because I needed people to help me with work in the summer at some legal work. And in this particular student ranked as one of the top five students in our class after her first semester of law school, Cool. And she ended up getting a job as a first-year law student with summer solving a promo, which is very difficult to do.

[00:07:30] And it's very rare to get a job as a summer associate as a first-year attorney and Sullivan and Cromwell, but she did. And but because of the situation the pandemic, she ended up not that they canceled the program. Because obviously our offices are not open.

[00:07:45] So in addition to that job, so she came to work with me. But in addition to that, she's applied to all sorts of great schools to, as a transfer student had been accepted. But what made her so unusual or makes her so unusual? It's not that stuff. [00:08:00] What made her unusual was the way I watched her do her work.

[00:08:03] And and when someone is that successful that early on When a big law firm that's of that caliber can pick up on someone's characteristics that make them successful.  It's important to watch. And one of the things is this particular person had a lot of opportunity to get involved in trauma and she never did.

[00:08:22]She just powered through and was very friendly. And she also got very complicated assignments that frankly, I'm very busy. So I didn't give her a lot of guidance. But she figured them all out and turned in flawless assignments. And then  and did a very good job.

[00:08:39] And, but the thing is, she was working here. It's not the same, it's not a, I'm not a law firm. And I certainly have legal experience, but I offered her a position and it paid much less than she would have received. It's not as prestigious. And she could have complained felt sorry for herself.

[00:08:56] You could have chosen not to work as hard. She could have been [00:09:00] resentful that she had this opportunity. But instead she decided to do the very best she could. And this is something that very few people do. A lot of people, if they're not in the job that they want, or they're not in the position they want they feel sorry for themselves.

[00:09:14] They don't work as hard as they normally would. They they bring drama into the job. They they're resentful. They they feel sorry. They don't work as hard as they normally would. There's all sorts of issues, but this person didn't and and she didn't really care about the drama going on around her.

[00:09:30] She didn't care that she didn't have as good a position and that's very attractive. The world needs more people like that and how the world hires and advances, people like that. And most attorneys out there, if you think about it and yourself included regardless of their station, they're worried about something other than that.

[00:09:48] Our job and that's not good. If your,  your job is to do the best with what you have in front of you, and you need to be focused on the job that's in front of you and doing the [00:10:00] absolute best you can and giving it your all. And very few people do that. And that's a huge problem.

[00:10:05]Because, if you're not focused on what's in front of you that's not good, and and most people, they, a lot of people will, get involved in drama though, and the drama can be internal. It can be psychological, like their own personal drama or the drama can be, other things for, to have, perhaps going on around them.

[00:10:25]No, but this particular person very interesting, not only did she, you do very good work without a lot of guidance, but she didn't feel sorry for herself. She treated it just as seriously as she would've treated. If she was working at Sullivan and Cromwell and, Did all sorts of very impressive things that you know, really are awesome.

[00:10:44] And very few people do that. And especially, if they don't have the type of job they normally expect. So I remember also  working with an attorney once who went to a top 10 law school [00:11:00] and he as in, in my job as a, as in, in placement and he got a very good job with a top law firm after law school, despite, not being, even in the top of his class or the bottom half of his class when he went to a good law school.

[00:11:13] Yeah. After maybe a year or half or so, he decided that he didn't like the hours. He didn't like, you know how demanding it was. I don't know, whatever the meticulousness of the job. I don't remember everything he told me, but there were a lot of things like that. That he didn't like the people he wasn't a big fan of his practice area.

[00:11:31]He didn't like where the office, I, bunch of things didn't want the life that the partners had. It wasn't something. And, everyone has complaints. And just to keep in mind that every complaint that you may have about a law firm there's certainly been tons of people before you that have had the same complaints.

[00:11:47]When people start exercising and they typically do not enjoy it. And then they learned to it. It's like that with the practice of law you may not like it at first, but but if you do something long enough, you're going to learn to enjoy it. But this, some [00:12:00] people just can continue complaining and with exercise, if you don't continually exercise it's going to have this consequences and if you don't commit to the practice of, on, you're always finding issues wrong with that, it's going to create problems too.

[00:12:13] But and it's not to say that's for everyone. I'm just saying that this. Process of just, thinking you don't like something and complaining  and as is very common. So this particular guy left the law firm and took a job as a government lobbyist. And he did it because he wanted to be appreciated and he didn't want to, have the same type of work.

[00:12:35] And he felt he wouldn't have to work as hard and and all these sorts of things and he, he did get a job and the job actually did paper. Very well, and it was in Washington DC. And but he took the job about six months before a presidential election

[00:12:51] and then his party lost. And when his party lost he lost his job and I don't know how the two were related exactly, but he lost his job. And [00:13:00] and then he started trying to find a position and and he couldn't get one. He, for several months before he came to me I worked with him and tried to find it.

[00:13:08] Him a job. He worked on his own trying to find a job and he couldn't and law firms wouldn't hire him. And and they wouldn't hire him because, if you think about it, why would you hire someone that shows that they don't want to work in a law firm? If you leave to go be a lobbyist, then the belief is probably that, you're not gonna want to work in a law firm.

[00:13:28] Long-term that you'll look for something else. Anytime you leave something and you find them. Reasons to leave or make yourself unhappy. If you want to go back to that type of environment a smart law firm is not going to hire you back again. They're just not going to do it. Think about it.

[00:13:42]If you were a law firm, would you do that? Because the person would probably leave and they have plenty of people they can choose from. So they'll choose people that have the commitment, but he ended up getting lucky. He got a job with a very good law firm in the Midwest and they offered him a job as a staff.

[00:13:59] Fraternity which [00:14:00] isn't great. But it was working in a law firm and and the physician had the would have given him the ability to or, he took it. So it gave him the ability to the, a to come back and to work in the loft.

[00:14:13]As after a year, he could get a permanent position with a law firm and. But the problem was as the job paid about 55% of what they pay their full-time associates he was able to be very charismatic and begged his way into getting the job and told the firm they wouldn't regret hiring him and how hard he would work and what a great hire he would be.

[00:14:33] And really talked himself into the job. But the problem was because the job didn't pay much. He was upset about it. And when he got there, even though he was excited or acted like he was to get at the time he felt that there's no reason that someone from his law school should be making such little money.

[00:14:51]He was critical of the firm and the partners are went there. He employed there as smart as him. He felt the work he was doing was demeaning and not important enough. [00:15:00] And he didn't like that. They wanted him to work there for at least a year before. He became an associate. And he also, of course, wanted to  when he got there, he told them that he wanted to transfer to a more cosmopolitan city that he was currently working on cause he was in the Midwest and he wanted to be in New York or Washington.

[00:15:18] And I think that office has there and as you can imagine, I'm sure that didn't go over well with the people that had hired him at Midwestern office. But the point is, what I want you to see is what he was doing was the same thing he'd done in this past previous position.

[00:15:32] He'd found reasons not to like it. And he'd found reasons to be unhappy. And instead of putting his head down and doing the best he could he was sabotaging this position again and just the girl with Sullivan and Cromwell she put her head down and, did a very good job and  her hardest and  and didn't feel sorry for herself.

[00:15:52]She didn't feel sorry for the amount of money she was making. She didn't feel sorry that she wasn't working for public corporations instead of, Harrison Barnes and his [00:16:00] stuff. And she, she put her head down and did the best she could, and that's the kind of thing that very few people do.

[00:16:06] So th the other thing too, I'm going to say about this guy is anytime you're working for a partner in a major. Law firm that has a lot of experience, you can't, you can never say that you're not as that person's not as smart as you or whatever. That's ridiculous.

[00:16:21]They're smart. They're their ability to be smart is not necessarily the same things you may think are important in terms of the quality of the law school.  Or how well they may have done on their, Alsace or grades when they were in college at Kanuga law school. I mean their smarts or their ability to have stayed in the law.

[00:16:37] From risen through the ranks where they are and impress the people around them. That's smart. And that's something that, you know, you, if you're young, like this guy was you haven't learned yet and you need to learn how to do, and you should respect those people. But he listed, all the things that were wrong with his job and all the things that were wrong with the law firm and and, sometimes he would call me, at home during the [00:17:00] Workday and he wouldn't be there and he'd want,  asked her.

[00:17:02] Search was going and and I'd be like why aren't you in the office? And be like they don't, they want to know that I'm, I'm not here and I'm supposed to be doing documentary if in the back office and stuff. And so he wasn't taking the job seriously. And, within a few months the law firm fired him and they, that's what happens if you don't, regardless of, how prestigious you think of places, or regardless of what's going on, if you don't do a good job, they are going to fire you.

[00:17:25]And you're not going to be happy. And his, he was more concerned with money the area of the country who worked in his title and the thing is, anytime you have a job, you should be grateful and you want to make the, get the best experience you possibly can. Out of it.

[00:17:41] And you don't want to find reasons to be unhappy in your job. We have control over a lot of things. We have control over, our relationships and who we're in relationships with. We have control over it. Our jobs until you can certainly, leave a job. But the point is there's always going to be a reasoning to whatever job you have to be unhappy.

[00:17:59] And [00:18:00] people that are successful and happy are able to tune out all this background noise about how things look to others or where they should be or what they should be doing. That's insane. When you're a young attorney, you have, this guy, maybe he's 27 or 28.

[00:18:14]He's got 40 more years of his career. You shouldn't. It'd be, all over the upset about this stuff and,  and you need to make the best of every situation you're in, especially, if you're not where you want to be, if you're not where you wanna be you start improving yourself and you keep getting to where you want to be.

[00:18:29] And then when you get to where you wanna be, you keep improving. And a friend that became so successful and makes more money I'm sure. And has much more prestige than most attorneys in the country. Probably didn't even score, probably got it on the 25th percentile on this SATs.

[00:18:44]No one cares. It doesn't matter. And too many people worry about things that don't have anything to do with where they're at. And  they instill drama into every situation they're in and you shouldn't if he'd done his best and built up political capital he'd be an associate now.

[00:19:00] [00:18:59] And they would respect that he put so much in and sacrifice when he was younger. When he wasn't getting paid a lot and he had a job that wasn't the best he would have gotten excellent references. He would have been able to maybe he could have put down roots and done well.

[00:19:14]And then, a big fish in a small pond. And but he was too concerned about appearances and  and, and, instead of doing the work that was in front of him and he wasn't taking it seriously, and he wasn't working in the office when he should have been, so those are problems.

[00:19:28] And, there's in law firms all over the country, there's partners, associates, and there's that, may think they're too good to be there, that they don't believe that they should have too much work to do. And work's actually a privilege you want to get as much work as you can. If people are giving you work, that's a good sign.

[00:19:44] If your firm has a lot of work, that means there's, good things going on there. And a lot of people find reasons to be unhappy. They don't commit because their minds are always somewhere else. I think they should be doing something else or they found it. No size and doing something else.

[00:19:57] And and many of these people, you can give them whatever they [00:20:00] want and they're never going to be happy and they never have been happy, never will. And that's the job of good law firms and good businesses is to weed people out that aren't committing and are trying their hardest and really  are looking the best.

[00:20:14]And it was funny. I many people just don't enjoy life. Because they're so concerned about, what others are, about prestige levels and what's the best and so forth. And and I was asking the other day and I was sitting at a table w when my children behind us, there was this table and these people from New York city.

[00:20:35] And and they were drinking wine Keala at the same time. I remember, I guess you can do that. I don't know, but and each, and they had all these bottles lined up that they had. Okay, so had brought out and and they seem to know everything about each and they were just discussing the costs of making them the taste things they didn't like.

[00:20:54] And and they really had the ability. It seemed to distinguish between different brands and where they came [00:21:00] from. And one was too earthy and and one was not smooth enough and they were just, it was awesome listening to this. I mean that they knew so much. I was very impressed, but at the same time, I knew that I could see that.

[00:21:12] They weren't really enjoying each H what they were doing. And they were each trying to one-up each other about, what they knew. And I don't know who these people were, but they were, kind of sewers. They were,  and and meanwhile, my children were, just sipping lemonade and haven't been very happy and these people weren't having, they didn't seem that happy.

[00:21:29]I guess they were happy, but the point was that they couldn't just enjoy what was in front of them. They had to. Compare all these different things. And and, think, say one, $300 bottle of wine. Wasn't good. And that sort of thing. And I thought, that's what a lot of people do is they're just, instead of doing what's in front of them, which would be drinking a glass of wine or drinking tequila, and they just they worry about things other than that.

[00:21:51] And they never enjoy things. So one of the things I've seen a lot of is, and this is [00:22:00] a big deal and it's something. The thing that I hope that, you'll understand the attorneys in large cities. I see a lot of times them dropping out of the practice of law and it's very common.

[00:22:10]They'll, we'll start with a major firm and then they'll drop out. And and they do this at a, quite an alarming rate compared to people in larger markets and the attorneys in large cities that do drop out of the practice law often tend to have the best qualifications. And they will.

[00:22:25]Drop out  and it's a shame because they, they, these are people that seem like they have a lot of potential. And and to me the sort of the opposite happens in smaller markets. Almost like the smaller market, the person who works in the more likely they are to continue practicing law.

[00:22:41] Yeah. And they, in, in markets where, you know where there's hardly any attorneys, it's very common. For people to practice very late into their career. And and I've wondered about this for the longest time. Why is it the large cities make people, not attorneys or why isn't that small cities give people a commitment to practice a law that doesn't exist [00:23:00] in large cities.

[00:23:00]And I don't, and I've always thought about this because I see it just over and over again. And something that I think is that in the largest legal markets, I think that there's so much competition. I think people are just making. So aware of all their inadequacies and, it's literally, they compare cars that they drive and take it very seriously.

[00:23:20] Then, they may not like their clothes or neighborhood or the schools or kids attended. And I have a kind of a funny story about close was I have this Ty, that's got some elephants on it and and every time I wear it in a large city, people ask me if it's from her maids, which is ridiculous.

[00:23:36] It's just from some local clothing store, but everyone is it's not, I'm saying it's, it's happened three or four times or maybe 20 years, so it's not all the time, but  it's funny. People are just very status conscious.

[00:23:46] They're more aware of the firm's prestige, where people went to school bonuses, how much people make and, so I think the people in the largest legal markets often are finding all of these reasons to be [00:24:00] unhappy compared to people in smaller legal markets where, you know, where these.

[00:24:03] Things, aren't all these things aren't necessarily emphasized so much. And and that makes them unhappy. There's just too much going on in their mind, except what's in front of them. And, and they may worry about, their social group and who likes them in the firm or there, that the client or spouse, or, clubs, and just all these different things.

[00:24:23] And then,  so people are worrying about all these things that have nothing to do about, really they should be. And trading on what's in front of them. Like my friend that wasn't, that intelligent is doing, what you can, and instead they're worrying about all these things and they're getting all wound up and, and then you get even farther down the rabbit hole and people start worrying about stuff like their political parties, or, you know what they're saying on one news network or another network.

[00:24:49] And and something that might someone, they may know of said something a couple of decades ago that they don't like, and. And then, the statues in town they don't [00:25:00] like, and, it's just or from maybe representing a company that's politically incorrect, non-approval that, and people just keep doing, going and going.

[00:25:07] And,  and these are all, some of the things I just mentioned are situations that, I've encountered with people and and people find all these reasons for not being happy and they get wound up. And this is drama, there's plenty to consume. Remind with and be angry about and things that you can, worry about if that's really what you want to do.

[00:25:26] But you have to ask yourself, is that a good use of your time and is that really gonna make you happy and  and help you my friend who is became successful honestly he probably doesn't even know what the difference is between Fox news and CNN in terms of their political views and how they communicate their thoughts, what they think to people and and and he really wouldn't understand what all the stuff's about so that is that a key is putting the stuff out of your mind and just doing what's in front of you.

[00:25:55] Is that a key to be happy? Because there's lots of stuff to worry about and be unhappy about, the people [00:26:00] that make things happen, the people that produce things, the people that work hard are the ones that become successful and have happier lives. And if you get involved in all this stuff it's tough.

[00:26:10] One night I was, a couple of years, several years ago. I don't know how long ago by a knowledgeable doctor that my ex wife and I are friends who came over to our house for dinner, and she's very smart. She had gone to Princeton and been a varsity athlete there.

[00:26:24] And I think two or three sports she's a neonatal surgeon, which is a surgeon who operates on babies and and. And I wondered really how she could concentrate now and working on these babies for eight hours at a time. These very, complex surgeries because she listened to a news network on her way over.

[00:26:42] And and it was either CNN or Fox. I'm not gonna say which one, but you'd think, she was so upset about it and for the whole I'm literally like foaming at the mouth, like the political commentary and, and she talked about it and. As if it was, communism or Nazi-ism, it was this horrible [00:27:00] thing.

[00:27:00]And if you think about it, like I in, in the most rural markets the attorneys drive pickup trucks and they ride horses on the weekends, they send their kids and, on buses to schools and and they're happy for the cases that walk in the door and and that's really what it is.

[00:27:16] And they're very smart. Markets and I've seen attorneys like that and it's, and they're very rural markets all over and and they're not clouding their minds with this stuff, like the way attorneys are major cities and they're not obsessing about it and they're not allowing themselves to be unhappy.

[00:27:31] And they're certainly not complaining about expensive wine and that sort of thing. The further you go from, the,  the rural. The attorney that works in a small market and doesn't have all the stuff upsetting them the more unhappy you're going to become, unless you're smart.

[00:27:47] And you learn how to, really control your mind and to be focused in the right way. And your job needs to be to be almost end. You need to be, you need to have your mind clear, need to make good decisions and you [00:28:00] need to not, bring all this extraneous stuff into how you do your job because.

[00:28:04] Is, the more you worry about other stuff and the more you apply to your mind and upset yourself. I mean that the more it's going to detract from you, I'm doing a good job. There's always, depending on how you perceive the world, there's always going to be all sorts of reasons to be upset and and you're always going to find ways to undermine yourself.

[00:28:26] If you're concentrating on the wrong things. Say a few things that may be offensive. But it relates to my own experience and it's, it is an example that also relates to, how people get exposed to situations and people that end up sabotaging them in terms of how they think.

[00:28:47] There's a older man that I know in Malibu and and I met him through somewhere else and he's pretty powerful. He runs a. Pretty major company and then, but he has a much younger wife and and he's always needed to [00:29:00] approve his wife's friends, which I thought was fairly unusual.

[00:29:02] And I, and and so he literally tells her, the people she can be friends with. And and the reason for that is he didn't he wants to make sure that his wife doesn't spend time on the wrong people. And he, because he believes that if that. That comes into her life, then that'll affect him.

[00:29:19] And and those kinds of people are, that he didn't I think were materialistic, gossipers people that are unhappy in their own relationships and overly focused what other people are doing. And and honestly, maybe the sorts of people that believe the grass is always greener somewhere else.

[00:29:36] And and when I talked to him about this, he told me that, he'd seen a lot. And marriages, and maybe it was one of his, I don't know that had died and had problems when the wives of the husbands started getting influenced by the wrong sorts of people. And and then they became unhappy. And when he met his wife, he met her in I dunno how he met her, but she was in a rural [00:30:00] Southern state Louisiana or Alabama or something like that.

[00:30:03] And and she couldn't believe how lucky she was to have met this. Major businessman and that sort of thing. And and they ended up getting married and and he swept her off his feet and like men vice versa, and, it's meant there's a lot of people that move to Malibu from around the country.

[00:30:20]Not a ton of people, but a lot of people move there. Because it's nice, it's on the beach. Most of it is. And  now my street, there's just a guy from Nebraska that owns a huge fertilizer company.  Like the brand and he has a younger wife and there's a man from rural Virginia that did something with stocks or something, and he has a younger wife and there's lots of stories like that.

[00:30:41]But people move hear from a lot of different places and it's not certainly, probably like Miami or something, but there's a lot of people and and a lot of these men end up marrying are in second or third marriages ended up marrying. Younger wives or they just bring their existing wives with them.

[00:30:57] So one of the things that [00:31:00] this man said to me and I'm and I don't know how true it is, and I'm just a messenger here, but he he said that, when these women that kind of came with these men or, came from other places that, were very impressed with their husbands and they had a good relationship when they started associating with certain types of women, they would meet th all of a sudden they started seeing their husbands in a different way than they may have been when they were in other atmospheres.

[00:31:25] And so they, maybe they believe they weren't rich enough compared to their friend's husbands or they they weren't really generous. They were selfish because other husbands had other things for their wives, or, they, maybe these husbands did weren't in the right social circles, like certain social circles, or, they knew certain types of people or they didn't take as good of vacations.

[00:31:45] Sure. The women didn't have as nice at cars as their friends had and and their husbands spent too much time working. Didn't spend a lot of time with them or they didn't have contacts with powerful people or they didn't live in the right part of the city compared to other people, or, these [00:32:00] are all re a lot of these are things that I've actually seen.

[00:32:03]Her or her that created issues, the husbands may drink too much, or they may and not respect them or they signed agreements, and so all these reasons suddenly to be very unhappy and those are the kinds of things that you know that people didn't like. And what happened is that all of a sudden, a lot of these people became very upset or that these women, their wives, and so forth according to him and and and they would demand, all these changes and then there would be divorces and and that sort of thing.

[00:32:31] But the idea of this is not that, women are impressionable or men are impressionable and while we are another, but it's that the people that we surround ourselves with and we're meeting allow ourselves to invite drama into our lives or invite these perceptions. A lot of times it can take what would otherwise be a very nice life or a very nice job as an attorney that we would be grateful for.

[00:32:51] I would have loved to have, years ago and can really twist it and make us unhappy. And it can lead to divorce and families and people [00:33:00] leaving jobs and all these things that may not necessarily  be a good thing. And and so you need to think of, how are you inviting these perceptions into your life and is that really what you want all the time?

[00:33:13] And  and a lot of these women, for example, they believed their husbands and really cared about them a lot until they moved to Malibu. And then Then they surrounded themselves with other people that, ended up negatively impacted them and and all of a sudden these women will see all the problems  that are reasons not to like someone that they necessarily wouldn't see in a different way environment.

[00:33:35] And I think about this because I think about attorneys and a lot of times, you may have, killed or, thought the greatest thing in the world would be to be. Become an attorney or to get a certain type of job and then you get it. But then you realize you, for whatever reason that you cloud your mind or you surround yourself from it ideas and so forth, they make it seem like it's not necessarily the greatest thing.

[00:33:55] And you know what I'm just trying to point out to you is your [00:34:00] perception and the things you allow in and your ways of seeing the world can really impact your happiness and. How you do in your career and in your life, if you allow these negative thoughts in any, are you obsessed with them?

[00:34:14]Instead of enjoying what's in front of you, which would be your job, your husband and your wife, you find a reason. And not to like it, and this is very common, and certainly changing jobs and changing spouses and stuff, there's positives to it. But at the same time, what, if you do the best for what's in front of you.

[00:34:34] So there's a story from a neighborhood I used to live in a Malibu and it's actually still going on to this day. And there was a woman that was very gorgeous when younger and she grew up in a small town. She had to eat lunch for free at school. Her parents would buy her clothing at a thrift store.

[00:34:51] And I know this because of a woman that I rented an office from was best friends with her. And and she married a A man from Los Angeles [00:35:00] who started a clothing company that became a major national brand. It's something you would have heard of stores all over the country and and for years, I mean he cheated on her.

[00:35:10]And she, and he she knew about it and and she never divorced him or even really stood up to him. But eventually at some point not too long ago, he sold the company for hundreds of millions. And and and people told her she was entitled to half the money and there was no prenuptial agreement.

[00:35:27] And and she divorced him and she walked away with almost a hundred million dollars an after tax money when she was in her mid forties, which is just awesome. Now at this point you would think that everything would be happy. But and she would be very happy and everything would be great, but she was what she did well.

[00:35:45]She became best friends with decorator who was a very expensive a decorator that saw the world in a certain way and the decorator and introduced her to absolutely the most expensive tastes in [00:36:00] ways of doing work possible. The woman bought a few homes for a boy, too much money and remodeled and decorated them.

[00:36:07] And there. Credible expense at the same with our office and and she run an office next to me in Malibu and for a small office, I don't know how big it was. It was maybe 1400 square feet. She spent hundreds of thousands of dollars. She brought in our Titians from Italy to paint the walls and hired these incredible contractors and  And paid too much for the rent.

[00:36:31] And within a few years  she had this office, which he wasn't using it, so she moved out and I actually rented it from her for awhile. And and it was funny. Yeah. It was so loud. It was so like, it was like sitting in a beautiful cabin I don't even know how to explain it.

[00:36:46]But yeah, it was so nice that a board on the ridiculous and people wouldn't walk in. Mr whispering. And it was very expensive tables and so forth and no one has any business owning. It was there was a conference table with this kind [00:37:00] of slab of I dunno, slate.

[00:37:03] I dunno what it was, but apparently it would cost over $250,000. It's just it was very expensive. She bought a house for $7 million and put at least $20 million into it for electronics for like stereos and controls for the house and Italian craftsman and cabinets and other things like that.

[00:37:21]And just  was so over the top and I went over there once and I walked in you a bathroom off the kitchen and, the lights like slowly dimmed on when I walked in then there was a separate light spotlight, the women to the center of the toilet from the ceiling, very much brighter.

[00:37:38] I reached down to open the led toilet to pee. And it's like a raise the toilet, a toilet flushed itself had some sort of missed or something. This, it was just incredible and warm towels and the water came out when I put my hands towards the sink and it was the right temperature.

[00:37:54] It was nice to have to remember. I'm seen. And I, when I said I had never seen a bathroom like that, I [00:38:00] walked out she told me that they're electronic. It's in our house, we've won many awards and magazines, whatever that meant. That was a source of importance because since she had this would have been a problem if the house was in a neighborhood of 25 to $30 million homes, but it wasn't, it was in a neighborhood where, you know, most of the houses were no more than $10 million.

[00:38:18] And, so she was putting all this money into something she'd never recoup. She did the same, with another house she bought on a Hill for 10 million, spend another 10 million fixtures. Yup. And then, so the, for 12 and and spent years of her life remodel on these houses and spending more money than she needed to with the same decorator she bought, she started a restaurant, a very expensive part of the city hired a mixologist to create cocktails and her decorator spent over a million dollars decorating the restaurant before.

[00:38:51] And even ever happened. And now the house with a fancy bathroom it's one of those awards is for sale for at least $10 million [00:39:00] less than she has to it. It hasn't to it. And then she bought another house for $3 million for her decorator. And and then and then eventually realize that the decorator had spent all of her money or most of her money And then for stuff that she wouldn't get any possible return on and she ended up kicking the decorator out of the house.

[00:39:19]This sound may sound inconsequential to your legal career, but it's actually very relevant. And and what's relevant about it is, this woman was influenced and she lost, I don't know how much you were a hundred million dollars. She lost, but she lost a lot of it because she was influenced by others, see the world a certain way.

[00:39:38] And she allowed someone else's perception of the world, meaning a decorator who thought that let's make things as good, as beautiful and perfect as we possibly can. She allowed that person's perception of the world to control how CCC saw the world. And and and that helped hurt her.  Because seeing the [00:40:00] lens, the the world through the lens of another  her.

[00:40:03] Tremendously. She allowed someone else's perceptions to take her money and also to drain her financially and to make her see, what normally would be very nice houses, all the things that were wrong with them and the change, their perception of the world and, what would be different with her life today, if she hadn't lost all that money.

[00:40:24] And if she'd just been grateful for what she had And if she didn't see the world through someone, else's eyes of what, perfection looked like with, decorating and spending in the best of everything. That's a big lesson. If you don't need to see the world through other people's eyes, you're going to be much happier and and you shouldn't allow people to influence you that much.

[00:40:46] I don't think, I think in this particular case, like she had this, it's a self-esteem issue, but. At the same in that it's an issue having been, not having money when you're younger and so forth, but it's the same issue that [00:41:00] attorneys get into when they start, needing to see, they have nothing they're never happy and they're always all this drama because of too much seeing so many things.

[00:41:10]When I was in college, I lived in a fraternity house for three years. And and in the class that graduated before me or the year, that I did before I graduated, there were about seven guys. Within a decade of leaving school two of them committed suicide and and they both came from a different types of environments.

[00:41:29] But one of the guys was from a small town in Oklahoma, his name was Curtis Fort. He'd come from a small high school. I've been the valedictorian there. And and I met him actually when I was a prospective student and and he seemed like one of the happiest people I'd ever met he'd been a valedictorian of a small high school and had big dreams.

[00:41:48] And but the problem was he came to the school and he didn't really have the ability to compete with the kids because he hadn't, had a rigorous, education and he'd come out of a different environment and, by the [00:42:00] sophomore year, he said a lot. Out of his high school classmates, the small town in Oklahoma, I had already gotten married and starting families and and he just,  he got some bad grades early on and he wasn't happy.

[00:42:13]Been in high school, he hadn't drank and then you started drinking and smoking pot all the time. And and then he got that grades and hurt his self esteem. And and then by the time. He was a junior his academic problems were too serious. And the school had asked him to leave and and he went and he, his self-esteem was crushed and, a lot of people that were in my class and his other people in his class  went to top medical long graduate schools.

[00:42:38] And but his environment didn't mean he didn't rise to it. And then he allowed himself to feel. Less than when he would have, if he had stayed in Oklahoma or whatever, or gone to a different place, he would have been happy, but he allowed the way others were doing to, to affect a man.

[00:42:56]I doubt if he didn't knock on any for Chicago. I think he would still be [00:43:00] alive but he was influenced by others in this perception. He suddenly saw himself as not as successful as he was. It was before. And and he couldn't fix his academic issues he gave up.

[00:43:12]And then he started brand new himself is, not the kind of person he wanted to be. And then and back in his high school, his friends were starting families and had jobs and were happy. And and so suddenly, if he'd been back there living there, he might've actually been happier.

[00:43:28] I'm not saying that, everyone. Small towns stay there, but I'm saying that, if you allow others to perceive yourself and how you perceive the world, and you allow that to influence your that can hurt you. And it can it's going to determine what happens to your life?

[00:43:44]Just like the woman with all the money, like perceiving, needing to perceive all this, success in the world and houses and so forth. And  and my friend Curtis. Who, probably is much smarter than even my friend in high school, but look at what happened to him.

[00:43:59] And [00:44:00] the similar thing happened in another guy. He came from a background in in Miami and his parents were from Cuba and and he grew up poor and he, he similarly had a similar experience and and allowed things to catch up with him. It's just these things.

[00:44:14] It's a serious stuff I'm talking about today. It's and because you allowing others to perceive how you perceive yourself and how you feel about yourself. And the environment influence you in a negative way is very dangerous. And and you can't worry about others.

[00:44:29] You need to do the best you can, you can't get all caught up and being concerned about what other people are doing. You have to realize that you're. You're going to have problems and you're not always gonna get what you want. But you cannot allow yourself to perceive the world and surroundings in a way that's going to hurt you.

[00:44:47] You need to always keep your eye on the ball and press forward, no matter why you need to do the best you can, and you can't allow your environment and things to negatively influence your now, [00:45:00] certainly Curtis could have  studied harder than other things and Giving up was a problem.

[00:45:05] And going over to the dark side was a problem.  You have to remember that, you need to we're focused on doing that your best and not focused on what the negative signal is your environment sending at you because environments will try to psych you out. That's what they do.

[00:45:19] A law firms will try to psych you out. That's what they do. But you need it. The best you can do is put your head down and press forward. And that's very different. Important people in the largest cities, a lot of times I lead the practice a lot. The, one of the reasons they do it was because they believed that,  they only concern should settle for the very best and and if they and if they don't get it, then they should be doing something else and that's just not right.

[00:45:45]And a lot of times they think that because they, they're concerned with how others will see them. I recently worked with a girl that was at a great firm Sheltie, Rothmans, and bell in New York. And she'd left to go on house and a cool job she had in house.

[00:45:58] But then her company that [00:46:00] she was working for, went out of business, something that happens to a lot of in-house companies and people, they can house jobs and and when she left shelter him and she was making a very good living. She'd been there, several years. And so she was making several hundred thousand dollars a year and she'd grown up in a relatively poor and went to a kind of inexpensive in state college and and then went to Columbia law school and did very well there.

[00:46:23] And so I was talking to her and she was very snobby. She was wanted to be only work in a law firm that was the same or better than the shelter. And and this was difficult because she was in house. And and she, she was now doing work in a different practice area than she'd been when she was there.

[00:46:40] And and I got her several interviews with smaller law firms and they were willing to hire her, but she just wasn't interested in these feminists because she didn't believe these were equal to the firms she was coming from. And and she was more concerned with, I think about how her peers would see her if she went to an inferior firm.

[00:46:57] And and I finally got her an interview with, [00:47:00] I think it was Sherman. And I'm not positive what the firm was. I think that was that. And and very good from like Sherman and they interviewed her wants, and then they interviewed her again and they interviewed her third time. And and so weanling wild whilst all these interviews are going on.

[00:47:14]She hadn't taken the job and she I'd ran out of money and moved out of her apartment and was literally living in a friend's couch, like hoping that the often Sherman Sterling would come and and I don't know, run out of money, but she,  couldn't afford them. Apartments. She was in, and so she was, her lease it up. And so she had and was moving and and after several weeks of waiting she just realized she couldn't wait any longer. And and she moved and decided to move in with their parents and and give upon the practice so off. And she literally ended up going back to school and yeah.

[00:47:45] And doing something that was unrelated to what she was doing instead of practicing law anymore. And started, huh? As someone in their, I don't know, mid to late thirties, I dunno when her higher age was. And we went to school to do something [00:48:00] else and her new professional or something.

[00:48:01] I think that she chose because of what cool something she was interested in. But I think she was more concerned about how she'd be perceived and and that's what concerned me so much about that and what she had done. And it's someone that I've actually stayed in touch with because I just feel so bad about it because it's such a great loss.

[00:48:18] School and did all these things. And but it seemed ultimately she was basing her life decisions on how others would perceive her. And after she moved to back to her parents the Sherman and Sterling called and they wanted to interview her again for the job. And I think at this point they probably were going to hire her.

[00:48:34] They just wanted to bring her in and she was already in school and and no longer wanting to be an attorney it's a shame. It's a shame to  to be like that. And a lot of people do that.  It's, it's a shame and I think we base our perceptions a lot of times on now other people see us and that influences what happens with our lives.

[00:48:53] And this was someone that was on the, very close to the absolute best you can do and my profession and [00:49:00] and ended up not getting it because of some decisions she made. Perceptions of others.  And how do those influence us? And that's a big problem.

[00:49:07] And and it's something, I think that hurts a lot of us.  When I was a young liar, there, there were and there still are these today, but they were on these discussion boards that came out and greedy associates from all over the country would compare notes and about what was happening.

[00:49:22] And I noticed that in my firms, everybody were. Started looking at all these different boards all day. And and these greedy associate boards were like people would, talk about their firms or talk about things that were happening and and what other people are making and bonuses.

[00:49:37] I think that's why they call them greedy associates and yeah. And people would get angry about this, and, today, your site, psych, the law top law schools and others that feed rumors and speculation and there's costs up and. People talk about what firms are most prestigious what law schools better what person is racist, what, all these different things.

[00:49:55] And they just go back and forth. And people, look at this and it [00:50:00] influences their view of the world.  They, they made like their job and then they stopped liking their job because of some rumor they or because some other law firms seems better and they, and people spend a lot of time on these sites.

[00:50:10]They spend time in these sites and they. Instead of concentrating on their jobs. They're worrying about what the sites say, which is just insane. And and they check in on them and they forward stories and meanwhile, they're not doing their jobs. Your life is going to become what you focus on and, if you focus on your job  then then you're going to do well.

[00:50:32] And if you focus on other things and you get upset about them and you focus on drugs, And that's who you're going to be as well. And  and what do you think is going to help you more? Is it better to focus on drama is a better to focus on other things. So years ago I was flying across on this cross country trip from New York to Los Angeles.

[00:50:52] I was coming back from some meetings and they can New York. And I was sitting next to a woman. It was older than me, not by much, maybe 10 years [00:51:00] older. And and and and we were both sitting in coach wait from the far back of the plane and, start asking the boar I live, I did for a living and so forth.

[00:51:09] And then she said something to me that, I thought it was nice. And she said something like, Oh, you seem very successful. You should be proud of yourself. And and and I should have taken a nicely like she was saying something nice, but I really didn't. Yeah.

[00:51:22] Said, thank you. And I said, but, I don't feel successful.  Don't, fly around in private jets and the, we're not as successful as people I work with. In other celebrities I know and so forth.

[00:51:31] And when people, my friends or my wife is friends quite, it's funny, I basically said, thanks for telling me I'm successful, but I really don't feel successful compared to your plan. No. And  and then she paused and she became very judgmental and it upset me at the time, but she said something like, you have, many issues.

[00:51:48] I'm not going to get into deep issues or something like that. It's very judgmental. What, what's wrong with this lady, and that was over a decade ago, it was quite a long time ago. And and the point was is, here are wise and [00:52:00] I, I had reasons to be happy.

[00:52:02]With my life and my career. And but I was telling this woman that I wasn't satisfied with what I was doing and I wasn't important enough that I didn't have all these certain signs of success that I knew people had. And there were people out there that were much more influential than me and so forth.

[00:52:17] And and and so therefore I, wasn't gonna allow myself to really take that compliment in which is a shame and I think a lot of people do stuff like that. And And I was doing at the time when I met my second wife she lived with her parents and apartment in Santa Monica was maybe $1,400 a month.

[00:52:34] And I was doing very well. When I met her, I had a a large company somebody in a big house I had maybe 800 employees. I'd helped her family with some things hired, a brother hired her and even her sister and other people. And the family thought I was great, know.

[00:52:50]And I had a nice wedding and there was and I paid for it. And and when I met her, she was very happy. She extremely fun to be around. And the first time I took her on a vacation, I remember we went to or the [00:53:00] Melodyne or something, and she was so excited to travel and fly internationally and she couldn't sleep online.

[00:53:05] Eco-system is rare. Nice. It's nice to feeling accepted, happy. And she was just very grateful and. And her gratefulness made me want to continue doing more and more for her. And and when people appreciate their jobs or people appreciate their relationship with us. We like that and it makes us very happy and and employers want to be appreciated.

[00:53:25] Your mate wants to be appreciated. Everybody wants to be appreciated and people want to, when you're giving your time or your money or affection people want to be appreciated.  Few years after we got married, we moved from Pasadena, California. Which is a very nice suburb of LA, but it's a trad